A Seventh-Day Adventist named Kevin Benta has criticized my post on Daniel 2 for misrepresenting the Adventist position. He didn’t say how, exactly, but here’s the only time the original post mentioned Adventism:
A lot of dispensationalists (both Evangelicals and Seventh Day Adventists) try and turn the iron/clay toes into another Kingdom, to turn it into a prophesy about the Second Coming, instead of about Christ and the Catholic Church. The only problem with this interpretation is that it’s wrong, and goes directly against what Daniel says. Note how Daniel begins this explanation as “finally,” because the legs/toes are one Kingdom — the Roman Empire.
So I’m assuming this is what he’s criticizing. Within this paragraph, I make two arguments he might be objecting to: that Adventists (1) treat the iron/clay toes as a post-Roman Kingdom, and (2) try and turn Daniel 2 into a Second Coming Prophesy. I can show examples of both from popular Adventist works.
There are three ways that I’ve read Adventists attempt to add a post-Roman Kingdom (or Kingdoms) to the prophesy. One is to argue that the Kingdom of Iron is the Roman Empire, while the Kingdom of Iron and Clay is the Roman Catholic Church. Another is to argue that the Kingdom of Iron and Clay is the European Union (although this is more Evangelical than Adventist). And finally, there’s the Millerite position,* which is the norm within Adventism. This is best seen with Uriah Smith’s extra Ten Kingdoms, and their descendants, which add dozens of intervening Kingdoms between the Fourth Kingdom and the Advent of Christ. Smith’s Daniel and the Revelation is perhaps the most important book on Adventist eschatology. In it, he writes on pages 57-58:
We are therefore held to the conclusion that the ten toes of the image denote the ten parts into which the Roman Empire was divided. This division was accomplished between A.D. 351 and 476. […]
But all historians agree in this, that out of the territory of Western Rome, ten separate kingdoms were ultimately established, and we may safely assign them to the time between the dates above named; namely A.D. 351 and 476.
The ten nations which were most instrumental in breaking up the Roman Empire, and which at some time in their history held respectively portions of Roman territory as separate and independent kingdoms, may be enumerated (without respect to the time of their establishment) as follows: Huns, Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Franks, Vandals, Suevi, Burgundians, Heruli, Anglo-Saxons, and Lombards. The connection between these and some of the modern nations of Europe, is still traceable in the names, as England, Burgundy, Lombardy, France, etc.
Smith proceeds to argue that Daniel 2’s fulfillment is a future event. So he’s separated Iron (the Roman Empire) from Iron/Clay (the bolded Kingdoms), argued that we’re still living in Iron/Clay, that Christ’s prophesied Kingdom is yet to come, and that instead of Four Kingdoms, there are dozens (the actual four, plus ten descendants of Rome, plus the modern nations of Europe). In contrast to this, Daniel 2 is quite clear that the Iron/Clay is still part of the Roman Empire — it’s the Empire before her collapse, when she’s internally divided.
Also, Daniel 2 is a reference to the First Advent of Christ, not an end-times prophesy. Christ begins His public ministry by saying: “‘The time has come.’ he said. ‘The kingdom of God is near. Repent and believe the good news!'” (Mark 1:15). While it’s true that the Kingdom’s total fulfillment isn’t until the end of time, Smith’s interpretation would mean that we’re to completely ignore the entry of the Kingdom of God into History in determining the advent of the Kingdom. That’s obvious nonsense. This hasn’t been totally lost on Adventists themselves: this criticism, from Adventist Today, makes clear that the futurist interpretation is the norm within Adventism, and shows why that’s a problem:
Despite the laborious research of scholars over the last century and a half, SDAs have learned nothing from them about Daniel 2. We have retained the basic prophetic positions of William Miller. Let me illustrate. The lesson assumes the sequence of Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome and the second coming of Christ. Thereby it omits the most important event of all the ages,’the first Advent and the Cross. But Matthew 21:42-44 applies the stone of Psalm 118:22 and Daniel 2:34,45 to Christ. Our Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary says ,“These words strongly reflect the thought of Dan.2:44, 45 (5:476.) To properly exegete Daniel, one must remember that it is not the practice of the Old Testament to separate the two advents. The kingdom of God is seen as a unit ushered in by the death of the Messiah and consummated at his return. Thus the parallel passage in Daniel 7: 13,14 is cited by Christ in Matthew 28:18 as applying to him because of the victory of the Cross.
So that’s what I’m referring to. Daniel 2 is a prophesy of the Incarnation and the creation of an unstoppable Church, and many Adventists and Evangelicals warp the prophesy and ignore the Incarnation to make it about the Second Coming. Any attempt to turn Daniel 2 into a Second Coming prophesy requires you to either create a post-Roman Fifth Kingdom preceding Christ, or pretend the Roman Empire still exists, or both.
*The Seventh Day Adventists descend from the Millerites of the 1840s. William Miller, their leader, was a false prophet who declared that Christ would personally return in 1843 or 1844, which obviously turned out to be false. A chart of the Millerite exegesis of Daniel 2 can be found here, and shows how this incorrect view of Daniel 2 helped yield an incorrect view of when Christ would return.
The Kingdom of God can not possibly begin at the incarnation of the Christ.
It is promised in the future to the little flock (Luke 12:32) It is a matter of promise to the apostles, and to all those who love God.(James 2:5), Through much tribulation the saints are to enter the coming kingdom.(Acts 14:22) It is to be set up when Christ shall judge the living and the dead.(2 Timothy 4:1), It is to be when He shall come in His glory with all His holy angles. (Matthew 25:31-34),
The Bible plainly declares that the kingdom of God was still future at the time of our Lord’s last Passover. (Matthew 26:29)
It would be good for you to read Hippolytus exposition of Daniel 2 and Daniel 7. It shows that the earliest Christians knew that the ten toes were the future ten divisions of the Roman Empire that would be destroyed at the event of the Second coming.
Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 are exactly parallel.
Get a copy of “Daniel and the Revelation” by Uriah Smith. Just for a reference of sources if for nothing else.
Subject: Daniel and the Revelation editions
Thank you for your Professional time.
Colporteur Ministry, pp`123 date 1905’s Writings, states, that the Book is to have wide circulation, therefore any revised copyrights after her death of 1915, safe to used? There was years past, considerable discrepancies came about within 1944 copyright revision. The1897 first edition, Spirit of Prophecy was referencing to CM?
Church Bible study with 1944 edition, and came about with complications of critics.
02.04.17
Subject: Daniel and the Revelation editions
Thank you for your Professional time.
Colporteur Ministry, pp`123 date 1905’s Writings, states, that the Book is to have wide circulation, therefore any revised copyrights after her death of 1915, safe to used? There was years past, considerable discrepancies came about within 1944 copyright revision. The1897 first edition, Spirit of Prophecy was referencing to CM?
Church Bible study with 1944 edition, and came about with complications of critics.
[email protected]
02.04.17
Seventh-day Adventists sadly misunderstand the Bible and history. Daniel 8:14 is about the Feast of Dedication (John 10:22-23)
and not about a Heavenly Investigative Judgment, which is a man-made doctrine that was approved by Ellen White. SDAs also
teach about worldwide Sunday laws and death penalties for not observing them, which have not occurred in the past century nor
have been seen in any major news sources. SDAs are only correct in teaching that Jesus is returning soon.
Daniel 8:14 is not about Maccabees, you can see that Jesus himself says the Abomination of Desolation is yet future.
How is Daniel 8:14 about the Feast of Dedication, when the visions parallel each other, and the Judgment comes after the little horn? Daniel 7:25 tells us that the Judgment was set and the books were opened. That’s a court scene.
Rome was the last secular kingdom that ruled over God’s people. The clay is a ruling power that is ADDED to Rome. The Papacy was a mixture of church and state that ruled that territory for over 1,000 years. The gospel has now spread OUTSIDE of the territory that was Rome. Today God’s people are WORLDWIDE. Therefore, in the last days, whatever state power is joined to the clay (church) is represent by the iron. The iron in the last days represents ALL kingdoms of the world. The iron progressed from being literal Roman territory, to being the entire globe.
Are they really still clinging onto and propogating the fear of the imminent Sunday laws?! How out-of-touch can such a large group of people really be about what’s going on in the world? locally, nationally and globally…?!
The are no threats to Adventists that are coming from Catholics, other Christians or nation-states! The Carholics & other Christians couldn’t care less! (The only thing that seems to get them worked up at all is homosexually). There is no trend towards forcing people to be more religious & to go to church on a specific day!
Are you kidding me?!
Most of the world is becoming completely secularized-thanks to western civilization BTW.
The only threat to Adventists, or any Christians for that matter, are coming from Muslim extremists who see it as their mission, goal & destiny to fulfill the prophecy of Mohammed that The Lord can only return when the entire world is under sharia law.
Are you now seeing in 2024, calls for Sunday rest?
Washington Post article dated Jan 23, 2024.
Time Magazine Jan 25, 2024.
Christianity Today Jan 30, 2024.
Please Google. Thanks!
“pretend the Roman Empire still exists”
It doesn’t currently exist it is as if the fourth kingdom has ‘been fatally wounded’ but Revelation 13:12 says “the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed” Its political power will be restored, in the last days.
The kingdom of God is near, just like Christ coming in glory has always been near.
“a post-Roman Fifth Kingdom preceding Christ”
If you look up any SDA source you will see they explicitly state the Fifth Kingdom is the God’s eternal kingdom
Have you ever heard of the Holy Roman Empire?
If you really want an accurate view of the End Times, I recommend visiting http://www.solagroup.org and http://www.Zion’s hope.org. Their views are based on thorough study of the Scriptures using the face value hermeneutical principle which is seeking to understand Scripture at face value by seeking the meaning the Divine Author, namely God, intended it to have.